
'Conclave' author on the tradition of selecting a new pope
Clip: 5/1/2025 | 6m 24sVideo has Closed Captions
'Conclave' author Robert Harris on the secretive tradition of selecting a new pope
Streaming viewership of "Conclave" surged 3,200 percent in the week after Pope Francis’ death. Viewers turned to that movie, which won the Best Adapted Screenplay Oscar, to help them understand one of the most secretive elections on the planet. The film is based on the novel by Robert Harris, who joined Geoff Bennett to break down the complicated process of electing the next pontiff.
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'Conclave' author on the tradition of selecting a new pope
Clip: 5/1/2025 | 6m 24sVideo has Closed Captions
Streaming viewership of "Conclave" surged 3,200 percent in the week after Pope Francis’ death. Viewers turned to that movie, which won the Best Adapted Screenplay Oscar, to help them understand one of the most secretive elections on the planet. The film is based on the novel by Robert Harris, who joined Geoff Bennett to break down the complicated process of electing the next pontiff.
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Learn Moreabout PBS online sponsorshipAMNA NAWAZ: Three thousand and two hundred percent, that is the massive increase in streaming viewership of the movie "Conclave" in the first week after Pope Francis' death.
Viewers turned to the film, which was nominated for multiple Oscars and won for best adapted screenplay, to help them understand one of the most consequential and secretive elections on the planet.
The movie, starring Ralph Fiennes, Stanley Tucci, John Lithgow, and Isabella Rossellini, is based on the bestselling novel written by former journalist Robert Harris.
Geoff Bennett spoke with Harris recently to break down the complicated process of electing the next pontiff.
GEOFF BENNETT: Robert Harris, welcome to the "News Hour."
ROBERT HARRIS, Author, "Conclave": Thank you for having me on.
GEOFF BENNETT: Many people are now turning to your novel and the movie based on your book to better understand what will transpire.
How true to life is what's depicted in your book and on screen?
ROBERT HARRIS: Pretty true to life, I think, I hope.
I was a journalist before I became a novelist, and I did a lot of research on conclaves before I started writing.
The procedure of the conclave is very clearly laid down by the Vatican, so that's easy to follow.
They also gave me a lot of help on locations.
I was able to see the places that are now about to be used for the conclave.
And I talked to a cardinal who'd been involved in the whole process.
GEOFF BENNETT: We are less than a week out from the start of the next conclave.
Help us understand what's happening behind the scenes.
What are the preparations like?
ROBERT HARRIS: Well, the cardinals will be getting to know one another and following -- everyone comes to Rome, obviously, for the late pope's funeral.
And for many of them, this will be the first time they have really spent a lot of time in Rome and met one another.
So, there's a getting-to-know-you session going on.
And then, on the Tuesday, I think it will be, the cardinals will arrive within the Vatican.
Their phones will be taken off them, laptops removed, and they will be given each of them a room in what's called the Casa Santa Marta, which is a hostel.
The rooms-- the windows are sealed.
So they're completely cut off from the outside world.
And then, the following day, Wednesday the 7th, there will be a mass, a speech from the dean of the College of Cardinals, and then they go into the Sistine Chapel.
GEOFF BENNETT: There are those who are demanding that the church institute a zero tolerance policy when it comes to priests and sexual abuse.
There are some cardinals currently participating in pre-conclave activities who are facing disciplinary sanctions following accusations of abuse.
How big of a role will the sex abuse scandal play in all of this, do you believe?
ROBERT HARRIS: Well, again, this is played out in the novel and in the film, where one of the candidates has a skeleton in his closet.
It obviously hangs over the Catholic Church.
They will be very alert for any possibility of scandal, that anyone might get near the papacy who might be investigated later and some problem discovered.
And they will be very anxious to avoid that.
GEOFF BENNETT: What are the various factions among the cardinals right now?
What are the competing visions for the future of the church?
ROBERT HARRIS: Well, the conclave is not supposed to be political, of course.
It's supposed to be purely spiritual, but inevitably political considerations come in, broadly speaking.
That is, traditionalists of whom Cardinal Ratzinger, who became Pope Benedict, was the foremost example recently.
They have their faction.
There are the liberal reformers, of whom Pope Francis was one.
So there is that division.
There is always controversy over issues such as the church's attitude to gay marriage or homosexual relations and to the role of women in the church.
So there are doctrinal issues such as that.
And then there are regional divisions.
It's nearly 50 years since there was an Italian pope, for instance.
And then, of course, there's the dream for many of an African pope, and Asia, where the church is really growing.
They may be looking to vote in a way that tries to make that happen.
So there are lots of sort of factions before the conclave even starts.
GEOFF BENNETT: Do you anticipate any surprises in the outcome?
ROBERT HARRIS: Well, there are generally surprises.
It's very rare that the media managed to tip the winner.
In fact, if you -- if someone goes in as a favorite, it's often counterproductive.
It puts a target on their back.
We will just have to wait and see how long the conclave goes on.
They will have the first vote on Wednesday afternoon.
There will be nothing after that.
That will be black smoke, certainly.
And then the next morning, there will be two further ballots and then two in the afternoon, if necessary.
If we haven't got a winner, a pope by the end of Thursday afternoon, then it will be a sign that there's quite a serious split developed.
GEOFF BENNETT: You were, as I understand it, inspired to write "Conclave" by the election of Pope Francis.
What was it about that moment in particular that struck you?
ROBERT HARRIS: Well, I was just watching it on television like everybody else.
And we were waiting for the new pope to show himself on the balcony.
And the windows on either side overlooking St. Peter's Square filled up with the cardinal electors who were coming to watch the whole spectacle.
And the camera panned along their faces, the elderly men, benign, cunning, crafty, transported with delight, looking grim.
And I thought, look at that.
That is the Roman -- the ancient Roman Senate.
And I have written a trilogy of novels about Cicero.
And it made me think that there must be something very political going on behind the scenes.
And I started investigating.
And, of course, it didn't tell me long to see that the conclave is the most extraordinary story, a gift, really, for a novelist.
GEOFF BENNETT: Robert Harris, the author of "Conclave," thanks again for joining us.
We appreciate it.
ROBERT HARRIS: Thank you.
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